Re: My Guide On How To Gain Traction On RoyalRoad And How To Potentially Turn Your Writing Into A Career

#41

Kagan Wrote: Wow! This was a very enlightening read. I'd like nothing more than to make a living writing stories, but I know that much of it is a game of chance or right place, right time. Still, reading this was very motivating. I'm still so new at this that I have no hope of hitting it big right now but I'll make sure to come to this thread whenever I need inspiration in the future!



I'm happy to have been of some help. c:

Re: My Guide On How To Gain Traction On RoyalRoad And How To Potentially Turn Your Writing Into A Career

#42

Lone Wrote:
Kagan Wrote: Wow! This was a very enlightening read. I'd like nothing more than to make a living writing stories, but I know that much of it is a game of chance or right place, right time. Still, reading this was very motivating. I'm still so new at this that I have no hope of hitting it big right now but I'll make sure to come to this thread whenever I need inspiration in the future!



I'm happy to have been of some help. c:



Would you mind if I asked a few questions pertaining to the thread topic?

Re: My Guide On How To Gain Traction On RoyalRoad And How To Potentially Turn Your Writing Into A Career

#44
I think you might make more, Lone if you went directly the self-pub route, you'd have to master some marketing, but it might be worth it. I think with KU you could easily hit 3 or 4k, although you'd have to talk to the LITRPG people actually doing it. My experience lies in other genres. 1.2k seems quite low, and I have a feeling being Patreon only is hurting you and you're missing out on a huge potential audience that never actually leaves Amazon. Full disclosure my full-time job is cover art and my clients make anywhere from 4-40k a month on amazon. (Obviously the big fish are outliers.) 

I've been working on some LITRPG stuff, and have debated posting on RR first and then moving to KU, or just staring on KU, or posting on RR and going the Patreon rate exclusively.  That said this information on how to succeed on RR was super helpful! :-) Thank you so much for providing it! 

The appeal of RR to me would be it would allow me to get real-time feedback on my work, and tweak it to match the audience as I go. The down-side obviously is lack of income. But there is a real risk in writing a whole novel, and then not getting traction after putting it out, and RR seems a way to get an audience. I'm not 100% convinced that you couldn't get similar results with a bit of FB ads, but on the other hand the LITRPG audience can be brutal in terms of reviews if you don't write something they like. So half of one half dozen of the other. 




Re: My Guide On How To Gain Traction On RoyalRoad And How To Potentially Turn Your Writing Into A Career

#45

Sr_fenn Wrote: I think you might make more, Lone if you went directly the self-pub route, you'd have to master some marketing, but it might be worth it. I think with KU you could easily hit 3 or 4k, although you'd have to talk to the LITRPG people actually doing it. My experience lies in other genres. 1.2k seems quite low, and I have a feeling being Patreon only is hurting you and you're missing out on a huge potential audience that never actually leaves Amazon. Full disclosure my full-time job is cover art and my clients make anywhere from 4-40k a month on amazon. (Obviously the big fish are outliers.) 

I've been working on some LITRPG stuff, and have debated posting on RR first and then moving to KU, or just staring on KU, or posting on RR and going the Patreon rate exclusively.  That said this information on how to succeed on RR was super helpful! :-) Thank you so much for providing it! 

The appeal of RR to me would be it would allow me to get real-time feedback on my work, and tweak it to match the audience as I go. The down-side obviously is lack of income. But there is a real risk in writing a whole novel, and then not getting traction after putting it out, and RR seems a way to get an audience. I'm not 100% convinced that you couldn't get similar results with a bit of FB ads, but on the other hand the LITRPG audience can be brutal in terms of reviews if you don't write something they like. So half of one half dozen of the other.



You aren't factoring in that Amazon is brutal to those that aren't already hugely popular, that my work is very unrefined, and that, most of all, I don't want to go to KU, regardless of how much of a cash cow it is. I don't want to be forced to remove my works for the entire internet save for on Amazon.

Releasing on regular Amazon is even more brutal unless you're already popular since Amazon doesn't care for you if they don't have you in a contract and they won't give you any advertisement.

I do plan to release on Amazon eventually (the normal version) but first I need to get my books to a point where I'm happy doing such an official release.

The money doesn't really matter to me but Patreon is stable. Amazon requires constant pumping out of books or for enough popularity for you to strike it rich or for people to keep buying your book(s).

Re: My Guide On How To Gain Traction On RoyalRoad And How To Potentially Turn Your Writing Into A Career

#47
Ideally, start off with a lot of chapters, to get onto 'new releases' quite often, show that you're committed to getting a decent amount of text out there and basically draw attention.  Once you've done that (ideally hitting trending), then you can slow down and be more regular.  This does mean that you should write the first load of chapters in advance though - have the first 30+ chapters done so you can release a load quite rapidly, then slow down a bit.

Re: My Guide On How To Gain Traction On RoyalRoad And How To Potentially Turn Your Writing Into A Career

#48
The money doesn't really matter to me but Patreon is stable. Amazon requires constant pumping out of books or for enough popularity for you to strike it rich or for people to keep buying your book(s).

**
If money doesn't matter, than not going into KU makes sense, and I get being wary of the amazon grind/churn. One of the reasons I'm thinking bout starting of in RR to begin with. Just thought I might give you some encouragement. :-) I love seeing authors make money.

Re: My Guide On How To Gain Traction On RoyalRoad And How To Potentially Turn Your Writing Into A Career

#49

Amber Wrote: Would you say it is more important to spam a lot of chapters early then slowing down the updates or posting less chapters per week but consistently over a longer period of time?



Like Mejiro said, though slightly different.

I'd say the ideal release speed is slow enough for the first month. Make sure a month has passed, you have a cover, and that you have at least 25 stars in total (not ratings). These are all qualifying factors for the trending list. Once you've done that, release literally as many chapters as you can every day.

Ideally, I'd say, like, 2-4 chapters a day. It's also ideal if they are of a good length. I'd suggest no lower than 1,500-words, above 2,000 is ideal.
Once you drop off of trending (assuming you get on it) then you can relax and write at a pace most suitable to your skills and whatnot.

Re: My Guide On How To Gain Traction On RoyalRoad And How To Potentially Turn Your Writing Into A Career

#50
Ohhhh. I posted daily till I ran out of chapters which was yesterday. I was considering going to weekly to make sure the chapters are of the best quality I can make. As well as maybe making like 5 chapters a week so I can upload them daily for a time being.  It's around two weeks, I think, till my fiction has been up for a month.

What would you suggest I do?

Re: My Guide On How To Gain Traction On RoyalRoad And How To Potentially Turn Your Writing Into A Career

#51

Kamikoto Wrote: Ohhhh. I posted daily till I ran out of chapters which was yesterday. I was considering going to weekly to make sure the chapters are of the best quality I can make. As well as maybe making like 5 chapters a week so I can upload them daily for a time being.  It's around two weeks, I think, till my fiction has been up for a month.

What would you suggest I do?

Trending is incredible for explosive growth, though it does have a tendency to garner a lot more negative attention on top of the positive attention than it usually warranted.


So, my advice would be to do what you're comfortable with. If you think you can hit trending and get a good rank on that list without pumping out chapters, you do you, my friend.

Re: My Guide On How To Gain Traction On RoyalRoad And How To Potentially Turn Your Writing Into A Career

#52

Lone Wrote:
Kamikoto Wrote: Ohhhh. I posted daily till I ran out of chapters which was yesterday. I was considering going to weekly to make sure the chapters are of the best quality I can make. As well as maybe making like 5 chapters a week so I can upload them daily for a time being.  It's around two weeks, I think, till my fiction has been up for a month.

What would you suggest I do?

Trending is incredible for explosive growth, though it does have a tendency to garner a lot more negative attention on top of the positive attention than it usually warranted.


So, my advice would be to do what you're comfortable with. If you think you can hit trending and get a good rank on that list without pumping out chapters, you do you, my friend.

Thanks, though I extremely doubt I can lol

Re: My Guide On How To Gain Traction On RoyalRoad And How To Potentially Turn Your Writing Into A Career

#53
On the topic of initial posting, I think the ideal posting rate might be more nuances than just so many in short period, or as many as reasonable and achievable. Rather than just spamming the Latest Updates, I would say the most important part is to expedite whatever number of chapters you need to get a proper story “Arc” out there while the story is new, preferable with said story arc being easy to read in a sitting or two for the average reader.

In other words, there needs to be enough for you to get into the story already, and it should be immediate enough to do so in 7 chapters or so. Something like that. Heck, you could even hook people enough just by the premise in the synopsis alone, but no reason not to play it safe, and hoard every advantage.

Exposure and marketing is secondary to that “product” for readers, so spamming Latest Updates is only a priority after you’ve achieved that up front story arc. The goal would be to at least have said introductory story arc done or near done by the time you get dumped onto Trending (if that’s your goal) and to figure out how to hype people for the story arcs that come up right after.

Knowing this, how to achieve a good start on your audience depends on the story, the premise, the characters, and the pacing, which might go a long way to explaining how some stories have buff word counts and update schedules that do meh, and other stories update once a month and have a cult following.

Re: My Guide On How To Gain Traction On RoyalRoad And How To Potentially Turn Your Writing Into A Career

#54

Endless Wrote: On the topic of initial posting, I think the ideal posting rate might be more nuances than just so many in short period, or as many as reasonable and achievable. Rather than just spamming the Latest Updates, I would say the most important part is to expedite whatever number of chapters you need to get a proper story “Arc” out there while the story is new, preferable with said story arc being easy to read in a sitting or two for the average reader.

In other words, there needs to be enough for you to get into the story already, and it should be immediate enough to do so in 7 chapters or so. Something like that. Heck, you could even hook people enough just by the premise in the synopsis alone, but no reason not to play it safe, and hoard every advantage.

Exposure and marketing is secondary to that “product” for readers, so spamming Latest Updates is only a priority after you’ve achieved that up front story arc. The goal would be to at least have said introductory story arc done or near done by the time you get dumped onto Trending (if that’s your goal) and to figure out how to hype people for the story arcs that come up right after.

Knowing this, how to achieve a good start on your audience depends on the story, the premise, the characters, and the pacing, which might go a long way to explaining how some stories have buff word counts and update schedules that do meh, and other stories update once a month and have a cult following.

Fairs, but my first arc will be around 5 chapters that are like 20k. So it would acc be about 50 uploads before I finish it and like 300 pages.

Re: My Guide On How To Gain Traction On RoyalRoad And How To Potentially Turn Your Writing Into A Career

#55
So what I'm hearing is that this site's readers expect really long books? If you're going to have a back log of chapters you can post daily then slow down and continue posting, a book of like 30 chapters would fizzle out in no time! That's good to know. As someone who tries to write succinctly and follow the old age wisdom of cutting out 1/4 of what you write, this could be a problem. Lol. 

Re: My Guide On How To Gain Traction On RoyalRoad And How To Potentially Turn Your Writing Into A Career

#56
There's a difference between 'web serials'/'web novels' and 'books' - a book (as in, a physical object, although these days it may be a kindle file or whatever instead) will have been produced as a single 'lump' designed to work by itself, generally with it's own internal beginning, middle and end; even if part of a series, a single book will generally have it's own internal plot arcs and whatnot (and will often have been written, and then edited as this single object).  A webnovel doesn't have this - it starts, and can go, and go and go and... (etc.)  They're typically written as serials, so each chapter will be read by itself, with a delay until the next one - so it's more like old-school serials, comics or manga.  This means that, yes, plot arcs can be a lot more meandering, plots can kinda vanish, and it's not unusual for editing to be done at the 'arc' level rather than the 'book' level, so what the writer had planned 150k words ago doesn't have much relationship to where it is now, because it wasn't planned at any higher level.  

Essentially, they're largely different items - a physical book will be maybe 100-200k words, split into up to maybe 100 chapters, and should come to an ending of some kind.  A webnovel is of unlimited length, with unlimited chapters, and may well not have a designed ending.  Think of webnovels as closer to long-running serials rather than books, and that's probably a better idea of what they're like, rather than a single physical book.

Re: My Guide On How To Gain Traction On RoyalRoad And How To Potentially Turn Your Writing Into A Career

#58

realitybend Wrote: Very helpful thread for a new writer on RoyalRoad. I just got my first patron supporter - all of $3 - and it felt like I had suddenly made it big. 

Question- if I already have more than 25 stars two weeks in, should I wait until a month starts before really pushing for more reviews to get on trending?

Yeah, I would suggest so, personally.