Re: The Huddlers ( Dedicated Thread for newbie authors. )

#521
I'm having a trouble about novel tenses and self-studying/ asking in the right forum didn't fully help me, so I'm here to seek everyone's kowledge and opinion.

As most of you know, in a novel we can write in either past or present tense, normally just stick to one of them. Most writers these days choose to write in past tense to make the feeling of "telling a story."

However there is some case in some novel, mine included, that the writer uses 3rd-person view and sometimes describe a fact by using an unknown outsider's view and knowledge.

In this case what tense should be used to describe the fact? Past or present? Given that the writer choose to stick to past tense for other sentenses.

Example:

Past tense

John drank the sea water.

"Salty!," he shouted.

Sea water contained a considerable degree of salt, so it was normal to be salty.

Present tense 

John drank the sea water.

"Salty!," he shouted.

Sea water contains a considerable degree of salt, so it is normal to be salty.

Which one is better?

Re: The Huddlers ( Dedicated Thread for newbie authors. )

#522
if i remembered correctly, it boils down to what context you're describing.

past tense for something that already happened.

present tense for something that currently happened. it can also be used to describe facts.

standard English rules apply, no matter if you're writing a story or an essay, but I guess on creative writing, it can be more lenient.

when someone tell you to not mix the tenses, it prolly cuz the storytelling needs to be consistent, whether it's told as past events or the current one, not jumping back and forth, so people could have easier time understanding the flow of events.

but there's always an exception to be made. some sentences, like the one above--the fact about the saltiness is best described with present. 

I'm not that good with grammar, so my knowledge may not be correct. but i usually use the rule: it's not about the grammatical structure first, it's more about making the sentences easily understandable intuitively and grammar check was to fine-tune it so others may understand better.

if you want the easy way you can just copy-paste your works to Grammarly, it's a really handy app.

Re: The Huddlers ( Dedicated Thread for newbie authors. )

#523
Wrote: I'm having a trouble about novel tenses and self-studying/ asking in the right forum didn't fully help me, so I'm here to seek everyone's kowledge and opinion.

As most of you know, in a novel we can write in either past or present tense, normally just stick to one of them. Most writers these days choose to write in past tense to make the feeling of "telling a story."

However there is some case in some novel, mine included, that the writer uses 3rd-person view and sometimes describe a fact by using an unknown outsider's view and knowledge.

In this case what tense should be used to describe the fact? Past or present? Given that the writer choose to stick to past tense for other sentenses.

Example:

Past tense

John drank the sea water.

"Salty!," he shouted.

Sea water contained a considerable degree of salt, so it was normal to be salty.

Present tense 

John drank the sea water.

"Salty!," he shouted.

Sea water contains a considerable degree of salt, so it is normal to be salty.

Which one is better?


If you want a more action oriented scene use present tense, otherwise use past tense.

I hope that helped!

:D

Re: The Huddlers ( Dedicated Thread for newbie authors. )

#524
Wrote: if i remembered correctly, it boils down to what context you're describing.

past tense for something that already happened.

present tense for something that currently happened. it can also be used to describe facts.

standard English rules apply, no matter if you're writing a story or an essay, but I guess on creative writing, it can be more lenient.

when someone tell you to not mix the tenses, it prolly cuz the storytelling needs to be consistent, whether it's told as past events or the current one, not jumping back and forth, so people could have easier time understanding the flow of events.

but there's always an exception to be made. some sentences, like the one above--the fact about the saltiness is best described with present. 

I'm not that good with grammar, so my knowledge may not be correct. but i usually use the rule: it's not about the grammatical structure first, it's more about making the sentences easily understandable intuitively and grammar check was to fine-tune it so others may understand better.

if you want the easy way you can just copy-paste your works to Grammarly, it's a really handy app.


Thank you. This really helps me a lot. Also, I'll try using this app.

Quote:
If you want a more action oriented scene use present tense, otherwise use past tense. 

I hope that helped! 

undefined


How about a fact?

Re: The Huddlers ( Dedicated Thread for newbie authors. )

#526
Wrote: Also, hello @Fay Voss. I'm doing NaNo too this year, though I'm trying more of a discovery approach, which is unusual for me. Let's see how it goes. :D

Ooh, pantsing it, eh? Have fun! I'm more of a plotser or plantser or whatever it's called when you blend the methods. Got an outline but it's bare bones and mostly thematic instead of scene-based.

Wrote: I took the fall and submitted World War E as my NaNoWrimo project. I'd orginally meant for it to be part of The OmNimbus, but decided to turn it into a full length feature. Good Luck with your project!

Awesome when a project extends itself past its initial run. You too!

Wrote: as for nanowrimo, i think about just writing the draft for my current project, just throwing ideas left and right, making use of what fits after the nano is complete. nothing that ambitious.

That's still in the spirit of NaNo. Messy drafts, etc.

MrZombie Wrote: I love it. Man, I'm a sucker for any type of art.

Aw, thanks!

Here's hoping for a successful NaNo! :) Even though I have yet to write even one word.

Re: The Huddlers ( Dedicated Thread for newbie authors. )

#528
Wrote: I'm having a trouble about novel tenses and self-studying/ asking in the right forum didn't fully help me, so I'm here to seek everyone's kowledge and opinion.

As most of you know, in a novel we can write in either past or present tense, normally just stick to one of them. Most writers these days choose to write in past tense to make the feeling of "telling a story."

However there is some case in some novel, mine included, that the writer uses 3rd-person view and sometimes describe a fact by using an unknown outsider's view and knowledge.

In this case what tense should be used to describe the fact? Past or present? Given that the writer choose to stick to past tense for other sentenses.

Example:

Past tense

John drank the sea water.

"Salty!," he shouted.

Sea water contained a considerable degree of salt, so it was normal to be salty.

Present tense 

John drank the sea water.

"Salty!," he shouted.

Sea water contains a considerable degree of salt, so it is normal to be salty.

Which one is better?


I don't know that I'm right, but I always thought of it this way... If you state a fact like "sea water is salty," you're speaking directly to the reader, which would make it first person. If it is in first person, I think you could get away with either depending on the sentence.

In third person point of view, I think most published authors would only use "is" in that case if they are directly broadcasting a thought or feeling, and it would probably be in italics, or incorporated into whatever structure their using to broadcast direct thoughts. But, in my opinion, that doesn't mean you can't go your own way. Who knows how much grief the editors gave them and why... I think there's probably an artful way to use "is" in that context. 

Yea, I know, I'm new here. I should probably ease into this.

Re: The Huddlers ( Dedicated Thread for newbie authors. )

#529
Keyboard Wrote:
Wrote: I'm having a trouble about novel tenses and self-studying/ asking in the right forum didn't fully help me, so I'm here to seek everyone's kowledge and opinion.

As most of you know, in a novel we can write in either past or present tense, normally just stick to one of them. Most writers these days choose to write in past tense to make the feeling of "telling a story."

However there is some case in some novel, mine included, that the writer uses 3rd-person view and sometimes describe a fact by using an unknown outsider's view and knowledge.

In this case what tense should be used to describe the fact? Past or present? Given that the writer choose to stick to past tense for other sentenses.

Example:

Past tense

John drank the sea water.

"Salty!," he shouted.

Sea water contained a considerable degree of salt, so it was normal to be salty.

Present tense 

John drank the sea water.

"Salty!," he shouted.

Sea water contains a considerable degree of salt, so it is normal to be salty.

Which one is better?


I don't know that I'm right, but I always thought of it this way... If you state a fact like "sea water is salty," you're speaking directly to the reader, which would make it first person. If it is in first person, I think you could get away with either depending on the sentence.

In third person point of view, I think most published authors would only use "is" in that case if they are directly broadcasting a thought or feeling, and it would probably be in italics, or incorporated into whatever structure their using to broadcast direct thoughts. But, in my opinion, that doesn't mean you can't go your own way. Who knows how much grief the editors gave them and why... I think there's probably an artful way to use "is" in that context. 

Yea, I know, I'm new here. I should probably ease into this.


Well, from a grammar point of view, both are correct. Normally, you should always state objective facts like 'sea water is salty' in present tense, but you can use past tense as well. In this instance, 'sea water was salty' implies that it used to be true in the past and can still be true now.
Personally, I would stick with past tense, since both are technically right and a sudden change in tense could break a reader's immersion.

That's just my opinion though. Again, neither is wrong.


Re: The Huddlers ( Dedicated Thread for newbie authors. )

#531
Wrote:
Keyboard Wrote:
Wrote: I'm having a trouble about novel tenses and self-studying/ asking in the right forum didn't fully help me, so I'm here to seek everyone's kowledge and opinion.

As most of you know, in a novel we can write in either past or present tense, normally just stick to one of them. Most writers these days choose to write in past tense to make the feeling of "telling a story."

However there is some case in some novel, mine included, that the writer uses 3rd-person view and sometimes describe a fact by using an unknown outsider's view and knowledge.

In this case what tense should be used to describe the fact? Past or present? Given that the writer choose to stick to past tense for other sentenses.

Example:

Past tense

John drank the sea water.

"Salty!," he shouted.

Sea water contained a considerable degree of salt, so it was normal to be salty.

Present tense 

John drank the sea water.

"Salty!," he shouted.

Sea water contains a considerable degree of salt, so it is normal to be salty.

Which one is better?


I don't know that I'm right, but I always thought of it this way... If you state a fact like "sea water is salty," you're speaking directly to the reader, which would make it first person. If it is in first person, I think you could get away with either depending on the sentence.

In third person point of view, I think most published authors would only use "is" in that case if they are directly broadcasting a thought or feeling, and it would probably be in italics, or incorporated into whatever structure their using to broadcast direct thoughts. But, in my opinion, that doesn't mean you can't go your own way. Who knows how much grief the editors gave them and why... I think there's probably an artful way to use "is" in that context. 

Yea, I know, I'm new here. I should probably ease into this.


Well, from a grammar point of view, both are correct. Normally, you should always state objective facts like 'sea water is salty' in present tense, but you can use past tense as well. In this instance, 'sea water was salty' implies that it used to be true in the past and can still be true now.
Personally, I would stick with past tense, since both are technically right and a sudden change in tense could break a reader's immersion.

That's just my opinion though. Again, neither is wrong.


Good points!

Re: The Huddlers ( Dedicated Thread for newbie authors. )

#533
Keyboard Wrote:
Wrote:
Keyboard Wrote:
Wrote: I'm having a trouble about novel tenses and self-studying/ asking in the right forum didn't fully help me, so I'm here to seek everyone's kowledge and opinion.

As most of you know, in a novel we can write in either past or present tense, normally just stick to one of them. Most writers these days choose to write in past tense to make the feeling of "telling a story."

However there is some case in some novel, mine included, that the writer uses 3rd-person view and sometimes describe a fact by using an unknown outsider's view and knowledge.

In this case what tense should be used to describe the fact? Past or present? Given that the writer choose to stick to past tense for other sentenses.

Example:

Past tense

John drank the sea water.

"Salty!," he shouted.

Sea water contained a considerable degree of salt, so it was normal to be salty.

Present tense 

John drank the sea water.

"Salty!," he shouted.

Sea water contains a considerable degree of salt, so it is normal to be salty.

Which one is better?


I don't know that I'm right, but I always thought of it this way... If you state a fact like "sea water is salty," you're speaking directly to the reader, which would make it first person. If it is in first person, I think you could get away with either depending on the sentence.

In third person point of view, I think most published authors would only use "is" in that case if they are directly broadcasting a thought or feeling, and it would probably be in italics, or incorporated into whatever structure their using to broadcast direct thoughts. But, in my opinion, that doesn't mean you can't go your own way. Who knows how much grief the editors gave them and why... I think there's probably an artful way to use "is" in that context. 

Yea, I know, I'm new here. I should probably ease into this.


Well, from a grammar point of view, both are correct. Normally, you should always state objective facts like 'sea water is salty' in present tense, but you can use past tense as well. In this instance, 'sea water was salty' implies that it used to be true in the past and can still be true now.
Personally, I would stick with past tense, since both are technically right and a sudden change in tense could break a reader's immersion.

That's just my opinion though. Again, neither is wrong.


Good points!


Thx for every opinion, I will try to adjust them to my writing. They all help me in choosing a suitable tense.

Re: The Huddlers ( Dedicated Thread for newbie authors. )

#534
I'm new here, and just poking around and figured I'd say hi.  

I'm new to Royal Road and to doing my own, original fiction online like this in a serial format. I'm not a new author though, as I've been a writer, editor, and developer for the Shadowrun Roleplaying Game for ages now, doing game rules, adventures, and short fiction.

My LitRPG fiction I'm posting here is something I've had kicking around in some format for probably 15 years now. It started life as a custom fantasy RPG and setting for a homebrew game, and has gone through a couple redesigns over the years, to the psuedo VRMMO setting that it is now. It's mostly existed as half-assed rules and piles of notes for various tabletop games though, and this is the first time I'm really putting it down in story format.  Been doing that for my Patreon for a while, so I'm a bit further ahead than whats posted here so far, but it's been fun and I'm looking forward to seeing what other folks have to say about it.  Assuming everyone doesn't hate it, of course :)

Re: The Huddlers ( Dedicated Thread for newbie authors. )

#535
Wrote: I'm new here, and just poking around and figured I'd say hi.  

I'm new to Royal Road and to doing my own, original fiction online like this in a serial format. I'm not a new author though, as I've been a writer, editor, and developer for the Shadowrun Roleplaying Game for ages now, doing game rules, adventures, and short fiction.

My LitRPG fiction I'm posting here is something I've had kicking around in some format for probably 15 years now. It started life as a custom fantasy RPG and setting for a homebrew game, and has gone through a couple redesigns over the years, to the psuedo VRMMO setting that it is now. It's mostly existed as half-assed rules and piles of notes for various tabletop games though, and this is the first time I'm really putting it down in story format.  Been doing that for my Patreon for a while, so I'm a bit further ahead than whats posted here so far, but it's been fun and I'm looking forward to seeing what other folks have to say about it.  Assuming everyone doesn't hate it, of course :)


Welcome to RR and The huddlers, we love to have you around here. Great work on the Shadowrun, I love the game.

Re: The Huddlers ( Dedicated Thread for newbie authors. )

#536
Wrote: I'm new here, and just poking around and figured I'd say hi.  

I'm new to Royal Road and to doing my own, original fiction online like this in a serial format. I'm not a new author though, as I've been a writer, editor, and developer for the Shadowrun Roleplaying Game for ages now, doing game rules, adventures, and short fiction.

My LitRPG fiction I'm posting here is something I've had kicking around in some format for probably 15 years now. It started life as a custom fantasy RPG and setting for a homebrew game, and has gone through a couple redesigns over the years, to the psuedo VRMMO setting that it is now. It's mostly existed as half-assed rules and piles of notes for various tabletop games though, and this is the first time I'm really putting it down in story format.  Been doing that for my Patreon for a while, so I'm a bit further ahead than whats posted here so far, but it's been fun and I'm looking forward to seeing what other folks have to say about it.  Assuming everyone doesn't hate it, of course :)


I played the SNES game version of Shadowrun and also a bit of Shadowrun Returns, it's a nice experience. I like Jake Armitage, he's a cool main character :D /

Welcome! I hope you enjoy your stay here.

Rather than not liking it, I think people in here would like to have some of your insights to improve ourselves or simply to enjoy the process of writing better :)

Re: The Huddlers ( Dedicated Thread for newbie authors. )

#537
Hello, my name is Stephen and I am very new to writing. I have read avidly since a young age and have lurked on royalroad for 4 years, although my account isnt that old. I have always wanted to write but could never think of a world or plot different enough from other works that it felt my own. Recently I finally had inspiration for a world however and went with it. 

This is not just my first time writing and posting something or my first time wtiting something I thought was decent but my first time writing anything at all ever even for myself. As such, I have no idea what im doing. 

I spent a few days typing over 10k words of world building and then got to work on the story. I currently have 5 chapters posted and number 6 is in the early rough draft stage. In the 3 days the story has been up ive gotten a few ratings and follows and a bit over 200 total views but not a single review or comment and so I have no idea how the story is. I noticed the majority of readers drop it after my first chapter, which is a sort of short 1 chapter side story elsewhere in the world helping to setup the larger stage. Chapter 2 is the same in a different area of the world and then chapter 3 is where we meet the heroine. 

Im hoping someone can at least read the first chapter and help give me some insight on why so many readers drop it there. Chapter 1 has about 60 views whereas the average for the other chapters is in the high 30s. 

The Twin Lands

Re: The Huddlers ( Dedicated Thread for newbie authors. )

#538
in my opinon, it probably has something to do with the formatting. it may look nice in a published novel with the indentation or such and it saves the page count, but in web display it's a pain to read for me.

try to break it down to smaller paragraphs. around 3 to 5 sentences or 6 at most per paragraph can be nice. 


Re: The Huddlers ( Dedicated Thread for newbie authors. )

#539
Wrote: in my opinon, it probably has something to do with the formatting. it may look nice in a published novel with the indentation or such and it saves the page count, but in web display it's a pain to read for me.

try to break it down to smaller paragraphs. around 3 to 5 sentences or 6 at most per paragraph can be nice.


Ya know I only read royalroad on my phone but ive never opened my own story on it, just the laptop. Ill try what you said after work today. Thanks.

Re: The Huddlers ( Dedicated Thread for newbie authors. )

#540
Wrote: I'm new here, and just poking around and figured I'd say hi.  

I'm new to Royal Road and to doing my own, original fiction online like this in a serial format. I'm not a new author though, as I've been a writer, editor, and developer for the Shadowrun Roleplaying Game for ages now, doing game rules, adventures, and short fiction.

My LitRPG fiction I'm posting here is something I've had kicking around in some format for probably 15 years now. It started life as a custom fantasy RPG and setting for a homebrew game, and has gone through a couple redesigns over the years, to the psuedo VRMMO setting that it is now. It's mostly existed as half-assed rules and piles of notes for various tabletop games though, and this is the first time I'm really putting it down in story format.  Been doing that for my Patreon for a while, so I'm a bit further ahead than whats posted here so far, but it's been fun and I'm looking forward to seeing what other folks have to say about it.  Assuming everyone doesn't hate it, of course :)


Wooah, I used to run SR 3&4 campaigns all the time back in the day. Welcome!

I'm gonna put it on my list.